G3 magazine pouches - BW versus Danish manufacture

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    Wolverine
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    G3 magazine pouches - BW versus Danish manufacture

    Post by Wolverine on Sun Nov 01, 2015 2:11 pm

    I was recently discussing this subject with another forum member. It is possible that the Danish forces used West German magazine pouches for the G3, but there were also Danish-made pouches. The colour and hardware are different, and the Danish pouch (on the right) has a Danish NSN (dated 1990), while the German pouch (on the left) has a German one. Otherwise, these pouches seem to be made from more or less the same drawings.




    Detail of studs for flap closure:
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    Re: G3 magazine pouches - BW versus Danish manufacture

    Post by Wolverine on Sun Nov 01, 2015 2:16 pm

    German markings:

    Danish markings:

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    Re: G3 magazine pouches - BW versus Danish manufacture

    Post by abefroman on Sun Nov 01, 2015 4:37 pm

    thanks for the post. that explains all the pictures of Danish troops with "German" pouches. How difficult are the Danish ones to find? And was this their only G3 pouch?
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    Re: G3 magazine pouches - BW versus Danish manufacture

    Post by Wolverine on Sun Nov 01, 2015 6:05 pm

    I think that they are not common to find outside of Denmark - that is where my few examples came from. I have never seen them elsewhere.

    Presumably one could also carry G3 mags in the ambidextrous pouches (as below), and somewhere I think I have a picture of soldiers wearing one German-style pouch and one ambidextrous pouch (need to find it to confirm).

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    Re: G3 magazine pouches - BW versus Danish manufacture

    Post by fallout on Sun Nov 01, 2015 6:33 pm

    Thanks for posting. I like the color on the Danish ones much better than on the German ones.
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    Re: G3 magazine pouches - BW versus Danish manufacture

    Post by CollectinSteve on Mon Nov 02, 2015 4:05 am

    The German ones are from the 1960s through the 1970s, as far as I know.  After that they switched from the laminated type to a solid soft plastic type.  The laminated type is, IMHO, vastly superior to the solid type.

    I have pictures of Danes wearing this type of mag pouch in 1997. The earliest mag pouch in Flecktarn I've seen is 1998, but there are other bits from that kit which are dated 1996. I'm guessing 1995 or 1996 is when they started making the stuff. From what I've been told the Flecktarn stuff was always hard to come by. Probably reserved for troops on deployment, everybody else getting stuck with the older stuff..

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    Re: G3 magazine pouches - BW versus Danish manufacture

    Post by Wolverine on Mon Nov 02, 2015 12:10 pm

    Yes, the laminated types from the BW normally have 1960s or 1970s dates. I don't know if I have any from the 1980s or not. The plastic pouches all seem to have 1980s dates, and seem to have appeared around the same time as the simplified y-straps, and gas mask carrier without the zipper. However, in BW photos from the early to mid 1980s, the laminated ones still appear, even with the new y-straps. I have quite a few plastic ones, and they have never been used.

    I agree, there is evidence that the Danes were wearing the old style, pre-Flecktarn webbing well into the 1990s.

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    Re: G3 magazine pouches - BW versus Danish manufacture

    Post by abefroman on Tue Nov 03, 2015 10:47 am

    CollectinSteve wrote:The German ones are from the 1960s through the 1970s, as far as I know.  After that they switched from the laminated type to a solid soft plastic type.  The laminated type is, IMHO, vastly superior to the solid type.

    I have pictures of Danes wearing this type of mag pouch in 1997.  The earliest mag pouch in Flecktarn I've seen is 1998, but there are other bits from that kit which are dated 1996.  I'm guessing 1995 or 1996 is when they started making the stuff.  From what I've been told the Flecktarn stuff was always hard to come by.  Probably reserved for troops on deployment, everybody else getting stuck with the older stuff..

    Steve

    I agree. The first evidence I have seen of Danes wearing the PLCE flecktarn webbing was in the Balkans 1995. Pitures of the Germans in Somalia in 1992 shows them having already switched over to the OD lift the tab pouches that eventually changed to flecktarn.
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    Re: G3 magazine pouches - BW versus Danish manufacture

    Post by Wolverine on Tue Nov 03, 2015 11:20 am

    abefroman wrote:
    CollectinSteve wrote:The German ones are from the 1960s through the 1970s, as far as I know.  After that they switched from the laminated type to a solid soft plastic type.  The laminated type is, IMHO, vastly superior to the solid type.

    I have pictures of Danes wearing this type of mag pouch in 1997.  The earliest mag pouch in Flecktarn I've seen is 1998, but there are other bits from that kit which are dated 1996.  I'm guessing 1995 or 1996 is when they started making the stuff.  From what I've been told the Flecktarn stuff was always hard to come by.  Probably reserved for troops on deployment, everybody else getting stuck with the older stuff..

    Steve

    I agree. The first evidence I have seen of Danes wearing the PLCE flecktarn webbing was in the Balkans 1995. Pitures of the Germans in Somalia in 1992 shows them having already switched over to the OD lift the tab pouches that eventually changed to flecktarn.

    Indeed, I think that the earliest OD German webbing I have (the new type with the WE 82 pattern-style belt and the 'Spanish' lift tabs) is dated 1988 or so. This makes sense too, because I remember as a kid in the late 1980s and early 1990s that there was suddenly a ton of the old style German gear in the surplus stores (belts, y-straps, magazine pouches, bread bags, canteens, etc). There still seems to be a healthy supply of German magazine pouches, both plastic and laminated.

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    Re: G3 magazine pouches - BW versus Danish manufacture

    Post by michelwijnand on Tue Jan 10, 2017 3:57 pm

    I know the photo you mean wit hthe 1 G3 type pouch, but the other one is an older M45-50 magazine pouch, not the slanted M45-59 one.

    The Danes seem to call the Fleck PLCE webbing M95 or M96, so the old webbing was still used even in the Balkans at some point even alongside the
    Fleck stuff.
    A Danish seller once joked that their troops in the Balkans were sometimes asked if they would get their actual gear later, and that's why they had the
    crappy old webbing Razz
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    Re: G3 magazine pouches - BW versus Danish manufacture

    Post by M55q on Thu Apr 20, 2017 7:27 pm

    michelwijnand wrote:I know the photo you mean wit hthe 1 G3 type pouch, but the other one is an older M45-50 magazine pouch, not the slanted M45-59 one.

    The Danes seem to call the Fleck PLCE webbing M95 or M96, so the old webbing was still used even in the Balkans at some point even alongside the
    Fleck stuff.
    A Danish seller once joked that their troops in the Balkans were sometimes asked if they would get their actual gear later, and that's why they had the
    crappy old webbing Razz

    The official nomenclature is M/96 for the PLCE webbing in Danish M/84 camouflage.
    Not widely distributed before 1997, according to the article below:

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    Re: G3 magazine pouches - BW versus Danish manufacture

    Post by CollectinSteve on Mon Apr 24, 2017 12:50 am

    Excellent information! Designations and what is part of the system all in one post Very Happy Thank you!

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    Re: G3 magazine pouches - BW versus Danish manufacture

    Post by abefroman on Mon Apr 24, 2017 11:10 am

    M55q wrote:
    michelwijnand wrote:I know the photo you mean wit hthe 1 G3 type pouch, but the other one is an older M45-50 magazine pouch, not the slanted M45-59 one.

    The Danes seem to call the Fleck PLCE webbing M95 or M96, so the old webbing was still used even in the Balkans at some point even alongside the
    Fleck stuff.
    A Danish seller once joked that their troops in the Balkans were sometimes asked if they would get their actual gear later, and that's why they had the
    crappy old webbing Razz

    The official nomenclature is M/96 for the PLCE webbing in Danish M/84 camouflage.
    Not widely distributed before 1997, according to the article below:


    Great post. This may inspire me to post my M96 gear....

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    Re: G3 magazine pouches - BW versus Danish manufacture

    Post by mikedenmark on Sun Dec 10, 2017 2:34 pm

    The uniform system was M84.
    The straps and gear is M96.

    (before the M84, there was the super rare forsøgsunifom in camo. I have been told only 3 coys were testing it.)

    Danish camo pouches for the G3 were made, but as planning for a new rifle was underway, few were made. I switched directly from old BW G3 pouches to camo pouches for my "new" M95 rifle.

    I have been told the camo pouches was a stop gap measure. They are very rare. I have only ever seen a few.

    The green pouch shown by wolverine is a all purpose pouch. It was not, afaIk, used for magazines.
    I recall its name was an A-taske A-pouch. I dont know where the A came from.




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    Re: G3 magazine pouches - BW versus Danish manufacture

    Post by Wolverine on Sun Dec 10, 2017 2:57 pm

    mikedenmark: are you able to recall if your old G3 pouches were German-made or Danish-made?

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    Re: G3 magazine pouches - BW versus Danish manufacture

    Post by mikedenmark on Sun Dec 10, 2017 3:19 pm

    I have never seen the BW pouch with a danish marking.

    They may exist, or they may be unmarked.
    Just at the end, we saw some pouches made of a thinner material. evidently newly made, but of lower quality than the older german ones.

    I can guess the danish army, if they didnt simply buy from the BW, may have placed an order in Germany for pouches. But, I am guessing here.
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    Re: G3 magazine pouches - BW versus Danish manufacture

    Post by Wolverine on Sun Dec 10, 2017 4:32 pm

    One would think that if an order were placed in Germany, the product would look very much like a standard BW pouch. Yet the pouches with Danish NATO stock numbers (as in my original post above) are a different colour altogether, and have different hardware from the German-issue pouches, which never changed very much over many years of production. Of course, it is possible that these ones with Danish NSNs were made in Germany, but the clear differences in appearance are striking.

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    Re: G3 magazine pouches - BW versus Danish manufacture

    Post by mikedenmark on Mon Dec 11, 2017 11:16 am

    I didn´t read the original posting in detail. My error.

    If they have a danish NATO number, they are danish purchase. I dont know if that means they are actually made in Denmark.

    The buttons at the bottom tended to break off/disintegrate in use. Now I see them, I recall those lousy brass buttons.
    The german one´s were okay.

    The green rubber material was thinner, and more flappy than the german type. Which meant to insert the magazines were more difficult. The front of the pouch caved inwards, and the magazines stuck upon the front pouch edge. You had to wringle to get them in.
    The german pouches kept their shape, more or less.
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    Re: G3 magazine pouches - BW versus Danish manufacture

    Post by Wolverine on Mon Dec 11, 2017 11:57 am

    Thank you: so there is no doubt then that both types of pouches were used - with German and Danish NSNs. We had been unsure of this until reading your information.
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    Re: G3 magazine pouches - BW versus Danish manufacture

    Post by CollectinSteve on Mon Dec 11, 2017 1:39 pm

    mikedenmark wrote: (before the M84, there was the super rare forsøgsunifom in camo. I have been told only 3 coys were testing it.)

    I assume you mean the T/78 uniform? Yes, very rare. I waited for many years to have jacket and trousers, recently I had two (the other went to an IACMC member). I have the jacket, combat trousers, and barracks trousers. I think the only thing I'm missing is the hood for the jacket.

    Wolverine wrote:Thank you: so there is no doubt then that both types of pouches were used - with German and Danish NSNs. We had been unsure of this until reading your information.

    Yes, definitely good information to have. It made sense for Denmark to have purchased surplus pouches from Germany. The price would be very hard for them to say no to. Danes are thrifty people Wink

    Thanks for the information Mike!

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