Korps Mariniers Webbing

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    Wolverine
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    Korps Mariniers Webbing

    Post by Wolverine on Sun Jul 20, 2014 9:46 pm

    Does anyone out there collect KM webbing equipment? I managed to locate some pieces during a recent visit to the Netherlands. This set incorporates US M1956 features and British 1958 pattern features.
    Here is some of what I have:

    Suspenders and belt - front and rear views. I believe that the D-rings on the rear suspenders are for attaching a poncho roll similar the 1958 pattern. I haven't found a poncho roll yet.




    Here are the kidney pouches, similar to 1958 pattern, and also the entrenching tool:



    Here is a strap assembly for carrying a sleeping bag or shelter half. Unfortunately this example is missing the snap-hooks that join up with the D-rings on the front suspender hooks. Someone has cut the stitching and removed the snap-hooks:




    Here the large pack, a close copy of the 1958 pattern. The second and third photos show how the pack straps mate up with the suspenders. The sleeping bag carrier works the same way.





    And here is a holster (I believe it is KM-issue, but I am not positive), and a first-aid pouch. The pouch, of course, is closely copied from the US type:




    I also have some ammunition pouches and a canteen set - more to follow later.

    Camonut314
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    Re: Korps Mariniers Webbing

    Post by Camonut314 on Mon Jul 21, 2014 12:41 pm

    Absolutely fascinating, I had no Idea that the KM had different webbing than the rest of the Dutch army. Although, with the idea that they have their own DPM it should stand to reason. Most of the photos I have seen of them on deployment do not illustrate the webbing as they are wearing the 1951 flak vests.

    Keep it up!

    Wolverine
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    Re: Korps Mariniers Webbing

    Post by Wolverine on Mon Jul 21, 2014 1:00 pm

    Thanks for the feedback.

    I have to admit that I have limited reference material on this webbing - I found what items I could on a recent visit to the Netherlands, and I still have a few more items to photograph and post.

    Based on the reference photographs that I have located in various publications, I suspect that this webbing was manufactured and issued during the 1970s and 1980s.

    I also believe that, during the 1950s and 1960s, the KM may have used other types of webbing that was inspired by American kit from the Second World War period. I will start a separate thread on those items eventually, and also one for field uniforms.

    Camonut314
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    Re: Korps Mariniers Webbing

    Post by Camonut314 on Mon Jul 21, 2014 1:11 pm

    Now that I would love to see. I actually have a KNIL tunic from the 50's and I am looking to put together a uniform representing that period, so any additional information about the uniforms would be most useful. I know that they did use quite a bit of British and American Surplus during that time period, web gear, camo coveralls, etc. At the moment I am trying to figure out what kind of trousers go with my shirt, it is a copy of the USMC P41 tunic, but produced in the Netherlands with the KM stamp on the breast. Photos I have been able to locate have been grainy, but is seems everything from surplus US army HBT's, P41's, and P44's were used, and maybe some Dutch copies, so I am at a loss!

    Wolverine
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    Re: Korps Mariniers Webbing

    Post by Wolverine on Mon Jul 21, 2014 2:23 pm

    Yes, there is no doubt that plenty of surplus material and clothing from US and British (and Canadian) stocks was in circulation, and I am also familiar with the Dutch manufactured HBT clothing for the KM - to my knowledge, there were matching trousers and jackets. What I am less sure about is the range of webbing items that were copied (closely or notionally) and manufactured by the Dutch. On my trip, I kept stumbling upon items that I had not seen before.

    Wolverine
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    Re: Korps Mariniers Webbing

    Post by Wolverine on Tue Jul 22, 2014 1:03 am

    Here are a couple of 3-cell FAL magazine pouches (cotton above, nylon below) - they can be worn on the belt, or in bandoleer fashion with the integral straps.

    I believe that there is also a 2-cell version of this pouch.



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    Re: Korps Mariniers Webbing

    Post by Wolverine on Tue Jul 22, 2014 1:05 am

    This canteen carrier may be specific to the KM, but I am not sure. It is made of nylon rather than cotton, and does not have the typical army markings or LTD snaps.



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    Re: Korps Mariniers Webbing

    Post by Wolverine on Fri Nov 20, 2015 6:23 pm

    I was finally able to source some KMarns poncho carriers (based on the 1958 pattern). Here is a picture to show how it fastens to the rear suspender D-rings (the kidney pouches would normally slide onto the belt, up above the poncho carrier). I have another version of the poncho carrier with webbing straps rather than leather ones.



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    Re: Korps Mariniers Webbing

    Post by Wolverine on Fri Nov 20, 2015 6:29 pm

    And here is the KMarns three-cell grenade carrier, very close in pattern to the US GI type.



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    Re: Korps Mariniers Webbing

    Post by Wolverine on Thu Jan 14, 2016 2:38 pm

    Has anyone ever seen a magazine pouch on the loose such as this marine is wearing on his belt? Let me know if you have one to sell or trade...


    (Photograph source is Peter MacDonald, The Special Forces, Chartwell Books, 1987, p. 209)

    Wolverine
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    Re: Korps Mariniers Webbing

    Post by Wolverine on Fri Oct 21, 2016 4:40 pm

    Here is a new KMarns item for my collection - a 3-cell FAL magazine pouch, without a shoulder strap. On the rear there is a brass hook that engages the pistol belt to keep the pouch from sliding off.



    masive
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    Re: Korps Mariniers Webbing

    Post by masive on Sat Oct 22, 2016 3:12 am

    Nice Collection of KM Webbing. In my experience it is not easy to find. I have mag pouches in white which use the MP of them. Here is a nice Link about their Equipment.

    http://johanskoudeoorlogmariniers.blogspot.de

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    Re: Korps Mariniers Webbing

    Post by Wolverine on Sat Oct 22, 2016 12:44 pm

    masive wrote:Nice Collection of KM Webbing. In my experience it is not easy to find. I have mag pouches in white which use the MP of them. Here is a nice Link about their Equipment.

    http://johanskoudeoorlogmariniers.blogspot.de

    Thank you. Yes, I have often referred to that page - it is very well illustrated.

    After several visits to the Netherlands, I agree that the KMarns webbing is not common to find.

    Here are some pouches made in white webbing, for pistol ammunition, and the FAL (this one is poor shape now):



    masive
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    Re: Korps Mariniers Webbing

    Post by masive on Sun Oct 23, 2016 3:12 am

    This is my pouch. I bought it in a Military and Outdoor shop. At the Time of the sale I did Not know what I have.



    Wolverine
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    Re: Korps Mariniers Webbing

    Post by Wolverine on Sun Oct 23, 2016 6:51 pm

    That is a pretty nice ample - still very clean.

    I have also a 2-cell pouch like this one in olive drab. I am still looking for the pistol magazine pouch in olive drab.

    I think there must have been a pistol belt made in white webbing, but I have not found one yet.

    CollectinSteve
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    Re: Korps Mariniers Webbing

    Post by CollectinSteve on Mon Oct 24, 2016 12:02 am

    I am not surprised that it is difficult to find this equipment. KM is not a large force and, as you have documented here, there was not a single style of equipment used for a very long time. I congratulate you two on being adventurous and stubborn enough to try collecting full sets of the stuff Wink

    Steve

    michelwijnand
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    Re: Korps Mariniers Webbing

    Post by michelwijnand on Mon Nov 14, 2016 3:02 pm

    You found the best website for info on KM webbing, Johan has pretty much every possible part there is.

    Does anyone of you have an extra poncho roll though? Early or late type would both be fine.
    I have pretty much everything else needed to make a full impression (apart for the backpack, which I count as an optional part) but can't find a poncho roll for the life of me.


    Here's my webbing as it is now. The straps hanging below the kidney pouches were added by the user, possible to rig around the pouches when they're empty. There's also
    a strap attached to the right shoulder, and an elastic to the left, possibly to function as a makeshift cheststrap or to attach some small piece of gear.


    michelwijnand
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    Re: Korps Mariniers Webbing

    Post by michelwijnand on Sat Jan 07, 2017 11:41 am

    Some more stuff I have.

    Nylon 2- and 3-cell magazine pouches, presumably meant for early 90's tropical issue, like Cambodia etc.




    Old type 3-cell magpouch, shoulderstrap seems shortened, as the crossloop seems to be lower than normal.




    M1 carbine pouches bought together with the rest. I now have 5 of these pouches, so if anyone needs some, I have a few to spare.
    No idea what the bottom pouches are, KL, KMarns, commercial....




    KMarns type K-mask bag. Which has an extra attachment to the belt, instead of just the M-1910 type hooks.
    These bags are easily available here, so if anyone needs them, drop me a line.



    Wolverine
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    Re: Korps Mariniers Webbing

    Post by Wolverine on Sat Jan 07, 2017 12:57 pm

    Nice webbing. I have also noticed that the Kmarns bags for the K-type mask usually have a small metal tag with the marine's service number inscribed.

    The small blue pouch next to the carbine pouches is from the air force.

    michelwijnand
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    Re: Korps Mariniers Webbing

    Post by michelwijnand on Sat Jan 07, 2017 1:48 pm

    Yes it does have that tag, the airforce one is to match with my other one, I'm slowly building an airforce webbing.
    I also have some M47 airforce pouches, like basic pouches but with a leather closure

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    Re: Korps Mariniers Webbing

    Post by Wolverine on Sat Jan 07, 2017 4:00 pm

    I have just started a new thread on KLu webbing, which I had been meaning to do for a while...

    michelwijnand
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    Re: Korps Mariniers Webbing

    Post by michelwijnand on Sun Jan 22, 2017 12:51 pm

    Some new pouches I managed to find yesterday.

    Nylon FAL-O 3-cell pouches, 2 pairs in different colors, no suspender strap at all, as opposed to the dark 3-cell I've posted before.
    The darker ones have cotton beltloops and closing straps, the bright ones are full nylon.
    Then some FAL 2-cell pouches, a bright one to match with the one I already had, and I found just a single dark one.
    And then a US LC-2 belt, which can be seen used in UNTAC KM photos.





    2 C3 gasmask bags, the top one is a replacement for the used one on my 80's KL gear, and the bottom one is of a very thin plasticized type
    that I think I've only seen on KM pics. Mind you, not all KL pics I have are good enough quality to make out the exact type.
    Notice the closure strap though, half as wide as the other type (and the 80's rubberized ones), and notice the date on the top pouch, 2 years
    before 1976 when everyone says the C3 was officially adopted.



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    Re: Korps Mariniers Webbing

    Post by Wolverine on Sun Jan 22, 2017 5:30 pm

    Michel I have seen the thin rubber C3 bags (which I believe are Dutch-made) and the Canadian-made TIL bags in various KL photos. Note: TIL = Textile Industries Limited.

    michelwijnand
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    Re: Korps Mariniers Webbing

    Post by michelwijnand on Mon Jan 23, 2017 6:55 pm

    Ok thanks, maybe I just have too few 80's Dutch pics saved, because it's one of the least interesting fields to most Dutch people haha

    Wolverine
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    Re: Korps Mariniers Webbing

    Post by Wolverine on Mon Jan 23, 2017 9:15 pm

    I can think of at least one decent view from a book that I will scan.

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