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    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi?

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    michelwijnand
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    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Empty P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi?

    Post by michelwijnand on Sun Apr 29, 2018 2:47 pm

    Mustardgreen-ish, black hardware, and just a small marking inside the pick holder.
    I'm sorta hoping it is Iraqi, so it can go on my set, but it's an interesting thing even if it isn't, as it's at least not British.

    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Dsc04637
    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Dsc04638
    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Dsc04639
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    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Empty Re: P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi?

    Post by Wolverine on Sun Apr 29, 2018 4:06 pm

    Yes, pretty sure this is part of the Iraqi set.
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    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Empty Re: P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi?

    Post by michelwijnand on Sun Apr 29, 2018 5:17 pm

    Great! 1 More piece to slowly make a set.
    Now I still need a right magpouch, belt, canteenpouch (and canteen) and optionally a backpack.
    I believe I remember a bayonet frog existing too, but seeing as I'm gonna put a Romanian bayonet on there, it wouldn't fit anyway.

    Heck even the other magpouch is just an extra for me, as this set might even has been used like this with 2 left pouches, seeing the matching discoloration.

    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Dsc03971
    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Dsc03972
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    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Empty Re: P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi?

    Post by Wolverine on Mon May 07, 2018 6:09 pm

    Here are a few more pieces which are probably Iraqi:

    58 pattern large pack, possibly Pakistani manufacture, found around Fort Bragg, about 1994:
    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Large_10
    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Large_11

    58 pattern kidney pouches, same provenance as above:
    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Kidney11
    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Kidney10

    58 pattern poncho carrier, same style as above, but found recently at a surplus store in NY state:
    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Poncho10
    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Poncho11
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    Post by Wolverine on Mon May 07, 2018 6:40 pm

    Here is a different style 58 pattern kidney pouch, found in a Dutch surplus shop a couple years ago:
    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Kidney13
    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Kidney12
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    Post by Wolverine on Mon May 07, 2018 6:41 pm

    A respirator carrier, found last year at a surplus store in France:
    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Respir10
    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Respir11
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    Post by Wolverine on Mon May 07, 2018 6:46 pm

    These items I am not too sure about:

    ammunition pouch:
    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Magazi10P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Magazi11

    44 pattern style belt (shade, and fittings are different from regular British 44 pattern, and there is no strap for the rifle stock):
    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Possib10

    I have seen canteens like this one advertised as Iraqi; I found this one in a bin full of Belgian canteens, but I don't think it is Belgian, as it does not even come close to fitting the standard Belgian canteen cup:
    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Possib11
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    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Empty Re: P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi?

    Post by michelwijnand on Sun May 13, 2018 3:10 pm

    That 2nd kidney pouch set, are you sure it's Iraqi? I've never seen any Iraqi kidney pouches that were a copy of the earlier British P58 pouches yet, without the extra strap to stabilize it to the suspender straps.
    Do you have any closeups of the materials used?

    And I like that gasmaskbag, probably predated the M74 type's rubber bag.

    And the magazine pouch below it, it looks smaller than normal, is that actually the case?
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    Post by Wolverine on Mon May 14, 2018 8:32 am

    No, I am not sure about the kidney pouches. I will take some better pictures of the canvas.

    The magazine pouch is for sure shorter than a standard 58 pattern pouch. It may not even be Iraqi either.
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    Post by Wolverine on Wed Jan 29, 2020 10:45 pm

    Getting back to this old thread - here is a complete set of Iraqi 58 pattern in grey web. Notice that the kidney pouches conform to the early British style, without the extra strap to stabilize against the rear yoke straps. The little utility straps are even included inside the lids of the kidney pouches.

    I also have the matching large pack to go with this. I am not sure where this version was manufactured. Any thoughts?

    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Full_v10
    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Kidney10
    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Kidney11
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    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Empty Re: P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi?

    Post by michelwijnand on Thu Jan 30, 2020 3:36 pm

    In the meantime I've seen several Iraqi ones of the old British style kidney pouches, so I guess I learned about that Smile I think I might even have a set with them on now, I should check my pics.

    No idea where your set could have been mad though, wasn't most Iraqi webbing stuff made in Pakistan or something?
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    Post by Wolverine on Fri Jan 31, 2020 10:59 pm

    I have heard Pakistan and/or China, but I haven't seen any proof either way.

    Here is a new find to go with my dark green set, the LH ammunition pouch:
    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Lh_amm10P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Lh_amm11
    It needs a RH mate!
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    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Empty Re: P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi?

    Post by michelwijnand on Sat Feb 01, 2020 12:40 pm

    Haha same as my previous webbing that had 2 RH pouches, failing to find one I just eventually sold it and bought this webbing as it was cheap enough.

    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Dsc06233
    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Dsc06234
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    P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi? Empty Re: P58 type Poncho roll, Iraqi?

    Post by Wolverine on Sun Feb 02, 2020 6:24 pm

    Story of my life...
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    Post by filupe on Sat Feb 22, 2020 7:40 am

    Having worked for an importer/exporter in Hong Kong in the 1980's I can tell you that almost every manufacturer of military softgoods in Asia were putting out their own version of '58 and '44 pattern webbing - they used to appear in company adverts in the trade catalogs.
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    Post by michelwijnand on Sat Feb 22, 2020 8:12 am

    Yeah there's a stupid amount of P44 and P58 webbing variations, most of them never seem to make it into the hands of people that identify them
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    Post by filupe on Sat Feb 22, 2020 8:58 am

    Wolverine wrote:... Notice that the kidney pouches conform to the early British style, without the extra strap to stabilize against the rear yoke straps. The little utility straps are even included inside the lids of the kidney pouches.

    As I understood it, the 'utility straps' were meant to anchor the top of the kidney pouch to the rear yoke straps. They would just feed in under the lid and then be tightened up against the rear yoke strap. At that length the 'utility straps' would really be useless for anything else ...
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    Post by Wolverine on Sat Feb 22, 2020 12:06 pm

    As far as I know, the utility straps are not related to the yoke. They are stored under the lids of the kidney pouches, and were meant for general purpose fastening. I agree, they are pretty short to be useful for much.
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    Post by michelwijnand on Sat Feb 22, 2020 3:08 pm

    I think you mix the utility straps up with the stiffened straps that came on the later version of the kidney pouches, that is actually used to attach it to the yoke's straps, so the pouches don't start sagging backwards.
    The utility straps are entirely unrelated to the yoke. I suspect they would be meant to strap stuff together that goes in the kidney pouches, so they don't rattle
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    Post by milly66 on Sat Feb 22, 2020 6:29 pm

    Hi all,
    Having used British '58 pattern gear for 6/7 years in the British Army, i can agree with Michel on the utility straps. I had 2 of these that i used attached from ammo pouch to ammo pouch around the back. This helped keep the pouches slanted/going back at an angle from the belt. This was good for shooting on the ranges in basic gear and also for combat gear as with the kidney pouches and poncho roll, as the poncho roll at this time was worn above the kidney pouches and contained the NBC suit. Hence no straps/connection from the ammo pouches to the rest of the load bearing gear. Rifleman Moore on YouTube has some great videos on '58 pattern web gear, 1st and 2nd types including trials gear that never made it to production. Well worth a look.
    Regards, Kevin

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