Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing

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    Post by Wolverine on Sat Jan 07, 2017 3:50 pm

    Here is a thread to explore Dutch air force webbing, in blue canvas.

    Ammunition Pouches

    Basic type with leather closure:
    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing Early_10
    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing Early_11

    Same as the M52 army type, but blue:
    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing Klu_ba10
    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing Klu_ba11

    SMG:
    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing Klu_sm10
    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing Klu_sm11
    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing Klu_sm12

    Carbine:
    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing Klu_ma11
    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing Klu_ma10
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    Post by Wolverine on Sat Jan 07, 2017 3:56 pm

    Various Markings on Braces and Belts

    M52 - identical to army type, except blue:
    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing Belt_m10

    Possibly civil defence (BB = Bescherming Bevolking?) - this belt has no buckles for attaching braces at rear:
    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing Klu_be10

    M52 type braces:
    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing Brace_10


    Last edited by Wolverine on Sat Jan 07, 2017 4:03 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    Post by Wolverine on Sat Jan 07, 2017 3:59 pm

    Packs

    M52 type pukkel:
    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing Pukkel10
    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing Pukkel11

    Pack support strap for M52 type ransel:
    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing Klu_su10
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    Post by Wolverine on Sat Jan 07, 2017 4:02 pm

    Unknown 'breadbag' in blue canvas - I have spotted these in some 1960s photographs of civil defence exercises. (I also have an identical example in army green.):
    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing Klu_ba12
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    Post by Wolverine on Sat Jan 07, 2017 4:58 pm

    Canteens and Carriers

    Early (M47?) carrier, after the British WE 37 sleeve type:
    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing Klu_wa10
    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing Klu_wa11

    M52 type:
    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing P1040310
    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing P1040311
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    Post by Wolverine on Sat Jan 07, 2017 4:59 pm

    Respirator Carrier

    For the K-type mask, dated 1967:
    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing P1040313
    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing P1040312
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    Post by Wolverine on Sat Jan 07, 2017 5:00 pm

    Belt for Trousers

    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing P1040314
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    Post by michelwijnand on Sun Jan 08, 2017 7:29 pm

    Nice stuff, some quite rare things here.
    The M52 pouches are almost never seen here, I just know of a shop in the south of the country that has heaps of the M47 pouches with leather tab closure.

    Does the breadbag have any markings? I've also seen these as modern commercial things, and have never seen them in old photos, so any proof that they're actual issue is welcome.

    Also good find on the p37 canteen carrier. Must be one of the last ones made since it's made in 52
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    Post by Wolverine on Sun Jan 08, 2017 7:43 pm

    Thanks.

    Would the WE 37 type canteen carrier be considered part of the M47 equipment?

    No markings on the 'bread' bag. But it pretty clearly shows up in black and white photos of a civil defence exercise in Amsterdam, from about 1968 or 1969. Take a look here:

    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing Civil_10Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing Civil_12

    I suspect that they are for first aid or other emergency supplies or tools.


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    Post by michelwijnand on Sun Jan 08, 2017 7:51 pm

    That's possible, not sure if the M47 designation was actually named for a whole rig of gear, of just the pouches though.
    And the pouch could be only for BB too, BB gear is about the same color as KLu stuff
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    Post by michelwijnand on Mon Jan 23, 2017 7:18 pm

    I remember seeing someone here posting a green KLu marked belt some time ago too, questioning why it was green, was that also you?

    It's probably because in the early 80's the M78 uniforms started to be move more to an actual green color. Before the M78 the uniforms were really grey, early M78's were grey too, but slightly different.
    From about 1983 onwards lots of uniform parts are actually grey-green.
    Last weekend I saw a shirt with a cardboard tag attached, even calling it jacket, field, green.

    I've seen photos from even later, mid-90's, where a green belt is worn with a standard KL canteen.
    So fieldgear probably went green during the 80's too.

    And about the BB marked belt, it's 100% the same as many KLu belts that also don't have suspender buckles, meant for dress occasions. Last weekend I dug through a box with dozens of them, while just needing 1 with actual buckles, because I only have one without.
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    Post by Wolverine on Mon Jan 23, 2017 8:56 pm

    Yes, that was me.

    So what you are saying is that KLu gradually started to use green webbing in the 1980s?
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    Post by michelwijnand on Tue Jan 24, 2017 7:42 pm

    Yes, though I don't know what exact year that started. Probably gradually after the uniforms started to become more green.
    Here's a pic from 95, I have a bigger one stashed somewhere, but he's wearing a green belt and green rubberized canteen pouch.

    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing 11e280e8-fbfa-27e9-8b35-0ca0b874f687


    Though here's another one, presumably early 90's, with a grey belt.

    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing 3eb403c3-d8b8-a627-c6d1-0c3bf7dc493f


    I also have an UZI magazine pouch that has been made green with blanco, either by some KL soldier that wanted a magpouch, or
    for the green KLu era
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    Post by Wolverine on Tue Jan 24, 2017 9:45 pm

    Thanks for the info.
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    Post by michelwijnand on Fri Feb 03, 2017 5:50 pm

    I have a cap from the 60's and one from the 80's, I'll take a pic of them side by side for comparison of how much the color changed.
    If I'm home tomorrow at a time there's still enough light for a good photo anyway.
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    Post by michelwijnand on Sun Feb 05, 2017 1:14 pm

    Here's a comparison pic of the caps, the grey one is 1967 dated and the grey-green one 1986.

    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing DSC02960

    And I uploaded pics of a full loadout with this KLu webbing on it in this thread:

    http://iacmc.forumotion.com/t11537-dutch-army-loadout-displays-cold-war-era#84806
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    Post by michelwijnand on Sun Feb 26, 2017 10:04 am

    So they do exist:

    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing DSC03079
    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing DSC03078
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    Post by Wolverine on Sun Feb 26, 2017 12:06 pm

    This is the first I have seen! Quite a discovery.
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    Post by michelwijnand on Sun Feb 26, 2017 12:10 pm

    The first for me too, and just for €4 in a pile of random stuff.

    Also of note is the hooks, they're situated about 4cm lower on the carrier, and in comparison with my green one they are inverted, meaning when hung upside-down the hooks are in the regular position on the belt
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    Post by Wolverine on Sun Feb 26, 2017 3:40 pm

    Interesting observation. Well, now I have to look for one of these too.
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    Post by michelwijnand on Mon Feb 27, 2017 9:06 am

    Oops, I thought one thing and typed another. The hooks on the KLu carrier are lower and situated normally, the ones on a KL carrier I sold a while ago actually has them the other way around for upside-down carrying.
    I should check what the same half-leather carriers hooks on my 50's KL loadout are like.

    Here's a (bad) photo of the sold one's hooks.

    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing DSC02604
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    Post by Wolverine on Mon Feb 27, 2017 1:26 pm

    I have several of these carriers - I will have to check them over to see if there are any variations in the hook placement.
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    Post by michelwijnand on Fri Aug 11, 2017 12:42 pm

    Reuploaded the photos from posts 16, 17 and 21 because apparently photobucket thought they weren't functioning badly enough.

    16
    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing Dsc02912


    17
    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing Dsc03011
    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing Dsc03010

    21
    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing Dsc02610
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    Post by michelwijnand on Sun Oct 08, 2017 10:28 am

    Finally got a complete KLu K52 gasmask bag

    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing Dsc03833
    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing Dsc03834
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    Post by michelwijnand on Thu Dec 14, 2017 5:35 pm

    Finally some actual 100% certain Dutch made KLu L-straps. Actually marked MvO as with all early KLu gear.
    I have 2 other sets but some are reused British WW2 RAF straps and others are either also that or unmarked Dutch.

    The buckle is of course not original to the straps, but modified.

    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing Dsc04029
    Dutch Air Force (KLu) Webbing Dsc04028

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