A.B.L. or BGS Compass Pouch?

I bought this Compass pouch from a guy in New Zealand who adverised it as Belgian, but now the same pouch has appeared on Ebay stating that it is Bundesgrenzschutz BGS.






https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BGS-Kompass-Tasche-Gurteltasche-Belt-Pouch-BW-Army-Nato-Irak-Ledertasche-Isaf-2/122716449525

Can anyone confirm its identity?  Is it Belgian if so is it ABL? or is it Bundeswehr BGS?  (or is it indeed either of these two?)
I am more inclined to believe that since the Ebay item is being sold in Germany, there is a greater chance that the identification as BW is more likely to be correct.

Thanks in advance for your reponses.

I haven't heard of a Belgian pouch like that one.

Thanks Andrew

I have Bodan (Askania) Compass . which is  ABL stamped.  The same compass was also used by the Bundeswehr and is around with NATO stock code with a country code of 12 for Weat Germany. (A version of the same compass was aslo used by Netherlands).

My thoughts are that it possible that the Compass made in Bielefeld West Germany , was supplied to ABL with a pouch that was also used by the German BGS, a pouch of German manufacture.

If so then same pouch could be both ABL use and also BGS use?

If Askanias were supplied to BGS with this pouch then the Belgian ABL compasses might have also had this pouch.

http://www.compassmuseum.com/hand/hand_1.htm#ASKANIA

Are you familiar with the pouch as either Netherlands or West German use?

As an avid collector of all things BGS and BW, I'd say it is neither. It's not like any other bit of field gear they ever used and (what I presume is) a manufacturer's stamped logo on the front would be a big no-no. They do not let manufacturer's advertise like that.

I do have some similar pouches made from light gray vinyl and another one in leather IIRC. No markings. Germans loved to mark their stuff, even law enforcement organizations. My rule of thumb is if it isn't marked AND isn't documented then it should be treated as commercial.

Not to say that commercial pieces weren't used semi-officially, that is. For something like a compass pouch, it's quite possible. But I'd guess it was one of the civilian organizations such as THW or ZB. Then again, even those organizations loved their stamps!

Steve

I doubt that the pouch is military issue, but that does not mean a soldier did not carry it. I have some Swedish-made compasses that came straight from Belgian surplus-probably not ABL standard issue items, but still used at some point.

Yup. Especially for items that an organization did not provide for at all or to the satisfaction of users. I can't think of an official pouch for German organizations in the early days, so I'm sure private or unit purchases remedied that to some extent. Lacking stamps/labels and/or documentation, the safe bet is commercial unless it is clearly of a military nature (e.g. a strange FN/FAL magazine pouch is unlikely civilian).

Steve

Thanks guys. may I add that the seller in New Zealand had 10 pouches for sale.

It seemed that he had obtained a lot of unissued or unsold items.

If the pouch was private purchase then I could see how the odd one might came up for sale via a Vet selling on his private purchase item. (But then the item would show signs of issue or use.)

I find it harder to understand how 10 "private purchase" items became available in mint condition at the same time.

My other thought is Askania might have packaged the ABL and BW marked compasses in this type of pouch purely for protection during transport, and although not part of the official order, the compasses might then have been issued in still in the protective transit case.

Obviously there is no conclusive answer as to why both sellers are claiming a miltary provenence to the same type of pouch.