IACMC MILITARIA FORUM

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nkomo
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    panzerwerk
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    Post by panzerwerk Mon Jul 05, 2010 12:04 pm

    Welcome Kan , sorry to hear about the ABU being a pain , but the ones who make the decisions never seem the ask the ones actually using the end product , its a very "pretty" pattern , but both the ACU and ABU color schemes seem very limited in usefulness . I dont think there will ever be a true Multi purpose camo unless they make a chameleon suit that changes with environment,thats cost effective to cloth our entire Armed Forces , someday LOL .
    Thanks for your service !
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    Post by Kan Tue Jul 06, 2010 9:36 pm

    Thank you, and no worries man, I'm just hoping someone with a little bit of silver on their shoulders/collars uses the ABU for some hard labor style work like the maintainers do. You know then that the AF will get some new uniform changes lol.

    Anyone else have any questions? I do know about the BDU and blues as well.
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    Post by AndrewA74 Tue Jul 06, 2010 11:50 pm

    Currently, does the Air Force use pin on rank or cloth slip on rank for the blues?
    Andrew
    Kan
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    Post by Kan Thu Jul 08, 2010 9:23 pm

    Enlisted wear sewn on rank on the main blues items, with some outer wear having rank pins on the lapel.

    Officers wear their rank on shoulder boards for all blues that I know of.
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    Post by CollectinSteve Thu Jul 08, 2010 10:09 pm

    Earlier you said that the 3rd Model (which is supposed to be lighter and have some more changes) is still not being issued as far as you know? I thought that was supposed to go into the chain sometime around the beginning of this year. Maybe they're going to use up old stocks first?

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    Post by Kan Thu Jul 08, 2010 10:24 pm

    I honestly think this '3rd' version doesn't exist to the general air force yet. I hear about it, but never see any proof or evidence. The only I have heard about a new ABU is something called the IABU (Improved), and last I heard, it is still 'in testing', and I am checking up on it every day.

    And what I have heard isn't that great, apparently they are only going to make a new top, and not pants, and this doesn't make sense to me, as any airman with good sense ditches his top back at the shop when there is work to be done. So a new top isn't needed, a new uniform or fabric is needed.

    I wish we all worn something akin to the MASSIF ABU combat pants and shirt.
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    Post by CollectinSteve Fri Jul 09, 2010 12:56 am

    Thanks for the answer! So it sounds like the 3rd Model is going to get a new name? That's interesting! Boy they are taking their sweet time with this one. IIRC the announcement of the new uniform was almost a year ago!

    The information I read is the same as what you said -> lighter weight top, no change to the trousers.

    It appears that the Air Force is going through the same "we can't admit we made a huge mistake" syndrome that the Army went through with the ACU. They were also going to issue an Improved ACU (at least I think that's what they were going to call it) when the Army finally gave in and said they would replace the camo pattern. My guess is the new Multicam based stuff will be based on what would have been Improved ACU. But that's just a guess.

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    Post by Kan Fri Jul 09, 2010 6:18 pm

    Theres one difference though. The army finally relented becuase they NEED effective camo and uniforms since they see combat alot, the AF, not so much. A 'majority' of the AF are people that sit in an office all day, and don't see issues with the uniform.

    What I think the AF should do, is improve upon the ABU for a garrison uniform, and create a maintenance uniform that has camo that fits for actual operations, with darker colors to allow for stains to exist without affecting serviceability.

    Any other questions?
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    Post by AndrewA74 Fri Jul 09, 2010 9:39 pm

    Kan wrote:Theres one difference though. The army finally relented becuase they NEED effective camo and uniforms since they see combat alot, the AF, not so much. A 'majority' of the AF are people that sit in an office all day, and don't see issues with the uniform.

    What I think the AF should do, is improve upon the ABU for a garrison uniform, and create a maintenance uniform that has camo that fits for actual operations, with darker colors to allow for stains to exist without affecting serviceability.

    Any other questions?
    Why not just go to the Blue BDU like the Coast Guard is using?
    Andrew
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    Post by CollectinSteve Sat Jul 10, 2010 1:43 am

    Kan,

    Theres one difference though. The army finally relented becuase they NEED effective camo and uniforms since they see combat alot, the AF, not so much. A 'majority' of the AF are people that sit in an office all day, and don't see issues with the uniform.

    Actually, oddly enough the exact opposite argument has been going on about the ACU since its introduction. Specifically regarding the cloth. Soldiers in non-combat situations found the uniform to be extremely comfortable, though a little airy in air conditioned offices. Soldiers in the field, however, found the uniform too easily worn out and damaged. Even more so in Afghanistan where the terrain is even harsher on equipment.

    It appears that what is really needed is a "combat uniform" and a "garrison uniform". They could have the same features and camo as each other, but constructed from different materials. Flame retardant for combat, for example. And soldier would also probably advocate having different weights for different environments, similar to the old BDU/DCU solid vs. ripstop. But the military doesn't want to do this for cost reasons so I doubt it is going to happen.

    Steve
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    Post by nkomo Sat Jul 10, 2010 2:58 am

    I would like to say thanks for your service and for this very informational thread. Thanks for taking time to answer our questions.
    Arch


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    Post by misanthropic_gods Sat Jul 10, 2010 3:39 am

    nkomo wrote: I would like to say thanks for your service and for this very informational thread. Thanks for taking time to answer our questions.
    Arch

    Agreed!
    Kan
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    Post by Kan Sun Jul 11, 2010 4:45 pm

    Thank you, and no worries guys, I've been more than happy to answer em for my fellow geardos and militaria collectors.



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    Post by nkomo Sun Jul 18, 2010 4:01 am

    Kan,
    Have you ever heard or seen any of the DF-LCS's in ACU color. I saw one made by GCS and the entire thing was ACU color, not the standard ABU. From what I understand, the Airman who owned it was USAF SF and worked with the US Army in A-Stan. Any ideas?
    Arch


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    Post by Kan Sun Jul 18, 2010 11:00 am

    I think you had a typo there, lol. I have not personally seen them in ABU, but I can confirm the existence. I met a army logistics guy and he gave me one of his older catalogs and I saw the rifleman's kit in ABU pattern.

    I have seen them in ACU as well though, as that whats issued to the SF here at my base.

    The reason for the lack of ABU being seen is most likely becuase that airman are authorized to wear acu patterned gear, when ABU is not available.

    On an off note, I had a once in a lifetime opportunity to grab a unopened set in EI OD while at one of the DRMO posts in Texarkana, but my conscience won out and I didnt take it. But interesting thing is that it's origin was my base. So one could think that there was either a mix up in the order, or someone had them buy the ACU ones and sent the OD sets to DRMO.
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    Post by nkomo Sun Jul 18, 2010 4:27 pm

    Kan wrote:I think you had a typo there, lol. I have not personally seen them in ABU, but I can confirm the existence. I met a army logistics guy and he gave me one of his older catalogs and I saw the rifleman's kit in ABU pattern.

    I have seen them in ACU as well though, as that whats issued to the SF here at my base.

    The reason for the lack of ABU being seen is most likely becuase that airman are authorized to wear acu patterned gear, when ABU is not available.

    On an off note, I had a once in a lifetime opportunity to grab a unopened set in EI OD while at one of the DRMO posts in Texarkana, but my conscience won out and I didnt take it. But interesting thing is that it's origin was my base. So one could think that there was either a mix up in the order, or someone had them buy the ACU ones and sent the OD sets to DRMO.
    So...then you have seen DFLCS in ACU in use with the USAF Security Forces? Interesting. Whst really threw for a loop was the ACU color. I had seen pics of them in ABU color, just not ACU.

    Do USAF Security Forces ever work in close contact with the US Army? Thanks!
    Arch


    http://www.gcswarrior.com/category_s/71.htm?searching=Y&sort=13&cat=71&show=80&page=1

    http://www.garrettcontainer.com/index.html

    http://www.garrettcontainer.com/deployment_kits/rfileman_kit.html


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    Kan
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    Post by Kan Sun Aug 15, 2010 7:17 pm

    Hey, sorry for not answering your question Nkomo, didn't notice it when I first saw your post.

    I'm not sure 100 percent but I believe that the SF do work with the army with patrols, but they definitely do the defending of the airbases.
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    Post by nkomo Mon Aug 16, 2010 4:10 am

    Kan wrote:Hey, sorry for not answering your question Nkomo, didn't notice it when I first saw your post.

    I'm not sure 100 percent but I believe that the SF do work with the army with patrols, but they definitely do the defending of the airbases.
    Thanks for the reply. Just wondering what a USAF SF would do when attached to a US Army unit? Any idea?


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